The latest Evaluating Gnosticism episode is now up!

The Yaldabaoth Pill:
P1. If gnosticism is correct, then the demiurge is in all likelihood the hero of their belief system.
P2. If the demiurge is the hero of the gnostic belief system, then he is de facto more worthy of worship than the distant, uncaring aeons.
P3. Gnostics believe that Christians worship the demiurge.

∴ Though gnosticism is false, even if it were true then Christians do best to not change their beliefs or practices.

Let's get into a bit more of this argument here as we review more Sethian literature:
https://soundcloud.com/verylutheran/evaluating-gnostic...
Actually it all makes sense if you think of the demiurge as being equivalent with the Jews
@Verfassungsschmutz To the contrary, a large number of gnostics *were* jewish, and that remains the case to this day.
Yeah because they aren't just gonna let you escape their mind control matrix without a fight, are they. They killed Jesus for this crime and they will do it again.

The Vatican is full of Jews and Judaizers as well, does this prove that Christianity is a false religion?
@Verfassungsschmutz Wait lmao did you not look at my username? Homie do really believe I think the Vatican is a properly Christian organization?

Also, what I'm saying is, there were jews and Gentiles *writing* texts that are found in the nag hammadi library. If you think of gnosticism as some anti-jewish movement, you're sorely mistaken.
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@SuperLutheran @Verfassungsschmutz I just started reading the gnostic gospels,From my understanding The Monad is God of all,Our Holy spirit is part of the Monad the spark,but we have forgotten and its trapped in the flesh time dimension by the Dimurge(devil) and his offspring the Arkons (serpents seed)are the agents of control,instead of looking outside to a pope or a church for salvation,one has access to the Monad inside ones self thru faith like Jesus did

@Scubbie @Verfassungsschmutz The vast majority of gnostic texts teach that you have to become a hyper ascetic and do endless fasting+navel gazing contemplative prayer to reach gnosis. Only one in ten gnostic writers held to a sort of "divine spark" theology.
Anyone telling you it's just about knowing some gnosticky sounding reddit doctrines is BSing you as to what the original gnostics taught.
@Scubbie @Verfassungsschmutz Also Valentinian gnosticism required you experience every activity man can experience, so you'd probably have to be sodomized and drink paint at some point if Valentinus was right.
I mean, that's an interesting concept, do you believe that Christ suffered every pain known to man when he died for your sins?

@Verfassungsschmutz @SuperLutheran So the Gnostics was not a religion,the gnosis is a muscle one can exercise to not be a normie following the cannon of a particular doctrine whether Catholic, or Protestant,obeying religious ceremonies is not required because these would be infiltrated by the Arkons thru time to control the deception.So the only truth can be sought from within the spirit,Every religion thinks there version is the one true version this is ego

@Scubbie @Verfassungsschmutz What you're describing isn't gnosticism though. In fact they were staunch institutionalists that sought to control the normal Christian church from their monastic enclaves, and most nag hammadi documents demand that you believe what they wrote or else you aren't among their elect.
They wrote stuff down, I've been doing audio commentary on all of it for years now.
@Verfassungsschmutz @Scubbie Great question! Presumably they took their beliefs seriously and starved themselves to death, or stayed in their monastic cells until they gracelessly expired in obscurity
And how do you know that this is because of Gnosticism being a false religion, and not just due to their excessive jewishness and inherited blood guilt etc.?
@Verfassungsschmutz @Scubbie Nag Hammadi is a few kilometers away from the first established "orthodox" monastery. These people really did live the lifestyle that they pushed, especially since they believed rejection of their own material body was essential to their salvation - to the point, as we read in Zostrianos, of attempted suicide when possible.
I mean, Christ arguably did not just attempt suicide, but actually succeeded (and managed to survive anyhow) — how do you know they weren't attempting to do the same (since that's what the gospels command us) and failed (due to a lack of faith perhaps)?
@Verfassungsschmutz @Scubbie St. Peter and the other Apostles all make it clear that Christ was murdered by crucifixion and rose again physically from the dead.
We know that the gnostics were not attempting to do the same because, as their writings have shown, they hated the human body in the first place and saw their deaths as an escape. The notion of a physical resurrection was repugnant to them. This is all stuff I've read out from their own writings and commented on.
Well if they did not believe in physical resurrection, how weren't they just Sadducess (according to Matt. 22:23)?

And isn't that basically the same as lacking faith?
@Verfassungsschmutz @Scubbie The Sadducees believed that death resulted in oblivion. Gnostics typically believed that oblivion was for the nonelect (or they were reincarnated). Meanwhile, their highest ideal was becoming a nonphysical entity that lived in the Plaroma with the aeons and platonic ideals. Sadducees believed in one deity, gnostics held to an endless array of emanating aeon deities, the list of differences is enormous
According to their definitions, would Jesus be considered a nonphysical entity living in the Pleroma? Or is He in fact a real person living on Earth?
@Verfassungsschmutz @Scubbie He has a physical body (as He demonstrates in Luke by eating food with the Apostles after the Resurrection), and has ascended to Heaven - wherein yes, physical things may reside
@Verfassungsschmutz @Scubbie Yes! And a perfect one at that, imbued with the glories inherent to a Resurrected body the way St. Paul describes in 1 Corinthians 15.
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@SuperLutheran @Verfassungsschmutz The history of the Gnostics was they tried to get them added to the Bible in Catholicism but 1 vote rejected them because teachings would take power away from the Papacy declared heresy by Irenaeus he was made a saint in the Catholic Church, Anglican Church, Lutheran Churches, the Eastern Orthodox Church, the Oriental Orthodox Churches, and the Assyrian Church of the East.and a Doctor of the Church in the Catholic Church by Pope Francis in 2022.

@Scubbie @Verfassungsschmutz Here's the canon list of Nicaea, please tell me which one does what you're saying it does:
https://www.newadvent.org/fathers/3801.htm

@SuperLutheran @Verfassungsschmutz The Synodal Letter a direct rebuttal of Arianism belief Christ was a created being not co- eternal with the Father the Monad,Arius of Alexander was condemned heresy & Christ was affirmed divine by the Christian Orthodox in relations to Yahweh, Gnostics often distinguished between “The One” an unknowable, transcendent source the Monad & Yahweh the one known as the Demiurge,later confirmed in 381 AD in councils ,constanoble & later Ephesus & Chaicedone

@Scubbie @Verfassungsschmutz Arius wasn't a gnostic lmao.
None of the ecumenical councils in your sentence fragment had anything to do with gnosticism, let alone confirming what you claim they confirm.
@SuperLutheran @Scubbie @Verfassungsschmutz Yeah for all his Faults Arius, to my Knowledge, never said "Lets throw away the OT."

@Brandschatzer @Verfassungsschmutz @SuperLutheran I am claiming that the gnostic texts were omited from Christian Orthodoxy because the theological chaos was a threat to imperial stability.It wasn’t just about heresy it was about identity, authority and the metaphysical divide of Arianism mirrored, and echoed, Gnostics mysticism councils were defining Christianity and both were ungovernable for the emerging Church.

@Scubbie @Brandschatzer @Verfassungsschmutz How much have you read from Irenaeus, Origen, Clement, the nag hammadi collection, etc.? Because I seriously doubt you'd be making this claim if you read any of them.

Here, if you don't have time to read any of it, you can take a listen to my audiobooks with commentary on the topics:
https://m.soundcloud.com/verylutheran/sets/evaluating-...
https://m.soundcloud.com/verylutheran/sets/reading-the...

@SuperLutheran @Verfassungsschmutz @Brandschatzer I have just started to read the Nag Hamadi collection as I stated earlier ,I don't claim to be authority on organized religion,I don't care much for Judeo controlled version of Christianity I also understand that Gnostic interpretations are flawed,I believe there is truth to be found in them as well,The Serpents Seed infiltrates ALL organized religion, governments,etc..for control,Gnosis to me is finding the truth in the lies

@Verfassungsschmutz @Scubbie Nope, though the suffering He experienced is greater than a man can imagine.
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