@blitzdriver @Tfmonkey Since it's winter weather, wouldn't he actually want MORE global warming?
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer Well, not totally, but it is an unpopular position for sure. This is why I can't join a church though. I see them all getting it wrong. Hypostatic Oneness is the destiny of all of us, just not the "I" you think of as "I." Union through theosis is just the dropping of ego...ending the Will's rebellion. But there's a whole further layer of the end of Self entirely that isn't talked about because it can't be conceived by the self. It's the deepest mystery.
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer And even they are heretical though. They all affirm that the man Jesus of Nazareth is the one and only God, like Egyptians believed about the Pharaoh or Shinto about the Emperor...which is just anthropotheistic paganism.
But this isn't the case. Jesus was a human person, first in unity with God and then after the resurrection...a non-person, devoid of Self, the same as a Buddha...in Hypostatic Oneness with God. An excellent example of perfect faith.
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer I consider all extant Christianity heresies, but Protestants certainly worse. Catholics messed up with introducing the "persona" as their explanation of the hypostatic union. Eastern Orthodoxy is workable though. Most Christianity today derives from St. Paul and the Alexandrian School. Paul, despite trying to show folks Christianity is not just for Jews, completely misinterpreted what the Christ is. Even Jesus misunderstood it. Only the risen non-person understood.
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer Bernadette Roberts is my favorite interface to Christianity btw, if you're curious.
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer As if. I grew up in an apatheist (apathetic theist) family and all my early exposure to Christianity was through Baptists and Pentacostals, both of which are well into the retarded and incredibly wrong side of things. I spent my teenage years squarely in the materialist intellectual camp until I started to see the issues there. Now I belong to noone but the Truth. I've been obsessed with Truth since I was 12 years old.
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer I've learned to love these paradoxes and contradictions, because they are the boundary stones of the mind. It's not that they're unintelligible or nonsense, just that this is a true thing unapproachable by the mind.
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer This is the real thing I struggle with...the cognitive level.
I think this is the edge of my own ego. I want to speak truth and have it accessible to everyone...and anyone who believes the nonsense due to cognitive load I want to just call an idiot and condemn them.
I want to say "I need to look at this" but I just did. I need to give it up now. I think you might be right on this point and I see the point of it.
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer It's not contempt of pro-socialness so much as recognition for the deep wrongness/paganism that religion inevitably degrades to when it becomes mass marketed. The contempt is for wrongness.
As soon as other people are involved, negotiations must occur and the will becomes involved. It's in silence that God is inevitably found.
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer I keep saying the journey is compatible with that life, but you keep thinking I mean otherwise. Maybe I was confusing when I said it doesn't matter if it's compatible, and saying that asceticism is the answer...
By "doesn't matter" I just mean it works the way it works and the problem is everyone wants their cake and to eat it too...like when cake = family.
By asceticism I mean denial of the Will/Self, not necessarily being a monk. Don't know a better word.
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer Point is, there is no social solution. Focusing on that in the context of spirituality is a fool's errand, but it gets most of the air time in Christian communities. Theosis is a process between you and Almighty God. Forcing Chrisitianity, or any religion, on a society just creates pretentiousness, power co-opting it for its own purposes, and stupid people using it for their petty, materialistic concerns.
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer Theosis IS the path, at least until unity. The next step is complete dropping of the self, not just the will. The character of Jesus was never the point...he's just the example of a fully human person who becomes non-person through thr hypostatic Oneness. And we all have the same destiny! That's the real bugger.
But this is theology way outside the Jesus Cult understanding of the process.
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer The Buddha nailed this one with the Middle Way. Self denial but not starving yourself.
It's not about becoming a monk (although that's the quickest path), it's about letting go of yourself, starting with the Will. If God's Will is just whatever actually is, then you surrender your Will to God's Will. That's the journey. It IS compatible with family life, but monkhood is quicker.
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer There's no answer socially. People have to work this out for themselves. Your theosis is between you and God, and it's not a matter of a specific religion either...which is just an aesthetic for the process of unselfing.
Christianity is a fine path when it's understood properly. Paul didn't even understand it though. He thought it was about Jesus not having original sin because the belief of the day was that the soul was transmitted through the father's side. All wrong
@UncleIroh @rohrkrepierer I don't get why you're calling me a materialist nihilist. Can you explain what that means to you? I don't see myself as materialist or nihilist.
No, I was never on board with Nietzsche and Will to Power. My avatar is Schopenhauer ffs.
The answer IS asceticism...the self seeking its highest good through denial of itself in seeking for God. Doesn't matter if it's compatible with everyday "family" life (it is, just harder in that setting). It just is the answer.
@rohrkrepierer I think the strongest case for Jesus Fascism is that most people need something concrete to focus on (keep God happy) and it can hijack materialism by giving benefits to spirituality, despite inevitable exploitation.
The social solution is just freedom. Let people work it out for themselves. The personal solution is asceticism...self denial until the ego drops away and God remains. Bernadette Roberts is great from a Christian angle. Buddhism seems to be all about this naturally.
But even though this is a rampant problem, Jesus Fascism is NOT the solution.
Christianity, sorry to say, is mostly a paganized Jesus cult anyways. The entire aim there is to "keep God happy so he keeps us happy," which is just materialism through superstitious means. The church should of stuck to Athanasius's concept of theosis.
The ego is the source of choice. Once gone there's no more choice. People have to be FREE to choose love of God, which means the possibility of choosing materialism.
Sex, money, and social status...the Three Pillars of Materialism. They're all there. And that's just for the people whose egos need a spiritual veneer to soothe the modicum of self-consciousness they have about choosing sensory pleasures over God. Most of the world doesn't even care at all and won't think twice about watching the newest celebrity twerk and sing about how much money and sex is in their life.
But it's clear that the modern world had no interest in this process. In fact, it downright celebrates the ego.
Almost all modern spiritualities are corrupted by this. They sell you yoga pants and say to be sex positive. They offer you crypto-backed seminars where you meditate or pray to "get over your fears of being rich." They have a whole political wing that sells itself, in part, as spiritually compassionate, so you can FEEL good about using the gov to improve your social status.
Joined Sep 2022
